| Subj: response to Jhanavi by Raghu - letters 1 of 2 Date: 1/15/99 To: news@chakra.org cheap hotel in SpaSubj: Re: letters part 1 Date: 1/15/99 To: pada@netroplex.com Haribol PADA I've been reading PADA's postings on my essay, Prabhupada's Magic Part 1 aswell as Puranjana's world famous editorials and Jahnavi's very moving follow-up. The essay has generated about 40 responses for which I am replying orwould have responded to you sooner. I would like to share these letters withyou since PADA's responses have been only correctional in nature and sofailing to fully represent the complete picture of the devotees reactions toit - overwhelmingly positive. Part of the reason for PAdA's dissatisfactionmaybe that neither - Purajana or Jahanavi - have read the 2nd part of theessay which I believe makes the point that both were trying to make. In a nut shell, I believe Puranjana was saying we have to correct the abuses.No disagreement there. We just have varying methods. His advice, reform canonly be had by smashing ISKCON's guru system which is nothing short ofthrowing out all the movements leaders and introducing the Ritvik system. Hefelt that I was not recognizing their efforts or the abuses they were alsosubjected to. The point of the essay was that what ever one wants to accomplish weatherreform, justice, or some other preaching project, will automatically beaccomplished by simply honoring the individual first and foremost. I offeredexamples of how others gave issues and projects first priority over concern tothe individual. My examples showed these tendencies - overtly or subtly - inleaders, teachers as well as many reformers (from ritviks and Iskcon, to guru-kula and childcare) and therefore all proved less effective as our own simpleefforts with the gurukula reunions and newsletters - past abuses exposed,persecuting teachers as well as re-igniting our spiritual lives etc Jahanavi seem to say I had failed to recognize the sincerity and motives,"agendas," of the devotees involved with the childcare reforms of our movementor the value of the Children of Krsna's work. She also stated that shedisagreed with me on a number of "points" but then failed to give anyspecifics but three - who raised the $ (Sridhar vs. Anutama) and that nothreats against ISKCON were made at the meeting. I have the video tape of theevent which I would be happy to give a transcription of wherein Krsna Avatarconcludes with, "we will take maters into our own hands" and that they will"do something" - meaning law suite. As for the fundraising, Anutama told mepersonally of his plans for starting the program months before the meeting andsaid he therefore helped to orchestrate the guru-kulis presentation with theintent of stirring the GBC into action - donating $. As for the 3rd contestedclaim wherein I say Svavasa has gone unrecognized by youth programs, pleaseconsider this. Prabhupada's Magic was written and sent out to members of theChild protection agency about two months ago as director of KOC - Sanatana'semail below confirms dated 11/23/99. I simply did not feature it publicly uponrequest from the ISKCON Communications Journal who wanted to be the first toprint it. Did my essay bring it to their attention leading them to feature itin "this months newsletter" 12/99. You decide. At least, it had not beenmentioned at the time of the writing of the essay. Jhanavi may very well bethe one behind on the facts. However, her concerns and issues are legitimateand the stories of the work that Children of Krsna is doing is as moving as itis important. Thank you. In both Janavi and Puranjana's case, the main concerns are answered in the 2ndpart of the Prabhupada Magic essay. The closing paragraph concludes withresounding praise of all the devotees involved in our childcare. I believethat reading this will help pacify Jahnavi and hopefully clarify for Purajanathe point I was raising in all the examples given from the child care programsto the rikvik efforts. Again, this point - lets not forget the individual inthe name of some cause or issue. Prabhupada didn't and that was his Magic asmy own experience with him demonstrates. The essay was so long so had to besent it in two parts leaving VNN posting the 2nd transmission 2 days later. SoI will include it here. The 2nd part meanwhile got posted on Chakras com.conference by mistake so some devotees read one part while others the 2nd. Sosome are responding to the 1st parts "really letting us have it" asKavichandra put it while others to the Prabhupada stories of the 2nd part. Before I do, let me give one last example of how empowering it is to startwith the premise of the individual first and working our way from there. Nowin Purajana's case, he says we must start by attacking the "abusers" etc.Here's a consideration though. Check this out. Did you realize that there are presently more "devotees" living outside then"in" ISKCON temples. Maybe 95% more. There was 6,000 to 8,000 Prabhupadadisciples. Hardly more then a couple hundred still live in the temples. Thisdoes not account for disciples of other ISKCON guru's and the movements othersupporters. Combined, they also represent 90% more resources and $$$$ andexperience - materially and devotionally. The combined wealth of the devoteesliving "outside" the movement runs into the tens of millions of dollars. Yet,are we doing 90% more preaching? Why not? Have we given too much attention -authority and influence - to the GBC leadership by focusing on what they arenot doing rather then on what we can. If we are serious about helping tocorrect the problems, we have 90% of all devotees to work with unhindered bythe GBC. Lets just assume all the temples and ISKCON leadership disappearedtoday and all we were left with was each other. What would we do? Do you see why the guru-kula newsletters and reunions exploded, because westopped giving the attention - power - over to the GBC by simply looking toour own peers at what we could between ourselves. In short, we created our owncommunity. And so can the older devotees. Beginning examples of this would bethe Prabhupada Festival and the World Enlightenment Day to the meetings inAlachua and LA. But this is only scratching the surface. Start recognizingeach other - your services and struggles etc and you will automatically beginto see your over all effect - a grand community of devotees. VNN for exampleis beginning to touch upon this, but is not fully tapping its potential whichwill be had when its focus is entirely on recognizing the devotees for theirbest - as our newsletters did for the guru-kulis. Then we will discover ourfull beauty, strengths, resources, potentials and common ground, goals andpriorities. In closing, here are some examples of the potentials to be uncovered. Imagineif we had a resource - Internet - guide that printed the highlights ofdevotees that held regular programs in their homes whether worshiping thedeity, to holding kirtans and offering prasadam feast. On this small Island ofHawaii, we have 20 devotees that have hosted such an event at some point.Multiply that by every town and village wherein a devotee lives and low andbehold we have formally recognized and empowered thousands of new preachingcenters and devotees. The same goes with harinam or those attempting farmingprojects, restaurants, guru-kula's - individual home-study programs includedagain totaling thousands of parents and kids. How inspiring would it be tohighlight every year all the Janmastami festivals around the world along withthe Ratha-yatras, food for life programs, or just listing all those chantingHare Krsna regularly, etc. What if every devotee living outside where tosimply pledge to distribute prasadam even just one day a year or bookdistribution - 1 book a day, 1 a week or one a month or even on just one day ayear. Hundreds of thousands of more books would be distributed. How aboutworkshops on child-raising or career counseling for breaking into theentertainment field or business development. We have devotees highlysuccessful - dozens, even thousands - that can provide a great dealinformation and otherwise. This kind of community would automatically lead toeach and every reform one could ever hope for just as the guru-kula newsletterdid for childcare. We will uncover these potentials and form into such groupsonce we have begun to identify the best of each other as the reunions andnewsletters did for the guru-kulis. The Rikvik issue is more about reformingthe GBC then honoring the individual devotees or "putting Prabhupada in thecenter" therefore its application is still does not have the broadest appeal.Once you have created this sense of community, we can accommodate each othersphilosophical differences - though not abuses. Here lies the answer to ourproblems - Prabhupada's Magic - and our future. The following are about a 3rd of all the letter received letters. I will senda copy of the Prabhupada Magic II essay later. BahudakSubj: Date: 1/13/99 7:49:42 AM Pacific Standard Time From: pchat@bcgrizzly.com (Peter Chatterton) To: Anudasa@aol.com Dear Ragunatha prabhu, Dandavats and Glories to Srila Prabhupada. My name is Bahudak das and I had two sons in gurukula Bhakta dasa also knownas GPD ( Gurupada das) and Kunjabehari das. Do you know them ? I was muchgratified to read your two articles and would like to commend your courageand fairness to both reveal the extent of the abuses and yet point outPrabhupada's kindness. I left the movement in disgust in 1987 mostly due tothe stonewalling I encountered from Jagadisha and others when they wereconfronted by reports of abuse. I had left the temple in a physical sensein 1986 and soon after my eldest daughter Devaki revealed to us that Mandalihad told her he was molested by Sastra dasa who was her husband at thattime. We advised her to come home which she did and in support of her bothKunja and Bhakta das spoke of Sastra's molestations of them. Both Kunja andMandali gave testimony to the police and Sastra was charged and convictedand jailed for a short time. However, when I brought reports of other abusethat the boys told me of there was no action or acknowledgement fromJagadisha. I ended up going on national television in Canada to denounce themovement as I was disgusted at the refusal to deal with molesters andsadists who were still active in Vancouver. For many years our whole family completely rejected Krishna Consciousness asa bad and tragic experience. I have come to a more balanced viewpoint myselfas I began to see attempts being made to deal with the past abuse and Ibegan to remember that Prabhupada was kind to the children and what happenedto them was in large part not his fault. I did not realize that you were soinstrumental in getting the truth out. Thank you very much. I have thegreatest respect for you for this. I am going to forward your two messages to my son Jake ( Bhakta dasa) andhopefully he will remember you and be interested to converse with you. Wereyou known by another name as a child? thanks again, Bahudak dasa. Kavicandra SwamiSubj: Part 1 Date: 1/13/99 7:45:42 PM Pacific Standard Time From: Kavicandra.Swami@com.bbt.se (COM: Kavicandra Swami (GBC Japan) Thank you for really letting us have it. I was very grateful for your newsletter [although I will admit that at timesI questioned your motive, sorry for that], because previously I never knewwhat went on in the Gurukulas. I feel guilty for that because I could seethat teachers like Raghunatha [the BIG] and the weird one with the longkurtas were unsavory characters, I never really looked into the matter. Of course I was a small timer in the early days, and not a "big leader". When SriRam prabhu made me a member of the Board of Education our first fewyears work was to try to make some provision for punishing and removingchild abusers from ISKCON. I think that most of the members of the boardwere sincere in that effort, although there was some opposition from somesections of the GBC and from the Vrndavana Gurukula. When did, under strong protest from Vrndavan, ban corporalpunishment. It seems like there are few cases of abuse in the schoolsnow, of course the schools are less and smaller. I don't think there isorganized and institutional abuse, as there was in the future. What upset me most about Burke's paper was that he seemed to acceptthat Srila Prabhupada knew what was going on, and did nothing about it.You did address that very nicely. But it was from your eposes {ex po zays}that we began to understand why theyouth were like they were. I can remember how shocked Birbahu Prabhu waswhen he read them. But even after that it took time before we could gettestimonies from the youth. Now we can understand their fears. There are some confusing points in your presentation. In part one yourcondemn Manu Prabhu, and apparently Anutamma Prabhu, but at the end youglorify them. I suppose that there is some explanation for that. Please forgive me for whatever neglect I have committed. Hoping this meets you in the best of health Your Servant, Kavicandra Swami Dear Kavichandra Fruhstuckspensionen ArendalYour letter is important for the devotees to hear because it shows howdevotees such as yourself in positions to correct the situation where bothsomewhat stonewalled as well as unsure where to begin. As for 2nd guessing my motives that is fair, but the info. should have takenpriority and as you said, it still took time to figure out where to begin andrespond. The "criticism" of Anutama and Manu has to do with the general sceptism amongthe guru-kulis with their initial efforts and my closing statements were abouttheir over all performance. Thank you for your recognition of my early efforts and hope that you foundthis last piece more a overview history then a condemnation. Raghu Madhava AsrayaSubj: Prabhupada's Magic Date: 1/14/99 5:59:20 AM Pacific Standard Time From: mario1@gate.net (Mario Pigna aka Madhava Asraya Dasa) All Glories to Srila Parbhupada All Glories to Sri Sri Guru and Gauranga Dear Raghunatha Prabhu; Please accept my respect, dhandavad pranava. After reading the open letter youwrote recounting your experiences and realizations in relation to SrilaPrabhupa, I felt obligated to write this short letter. I felt motivated withthe great service that you have done to others by clarifying somemisconceptions that the devotees have about the transcendental position ofPrabhupada. Very often we face the sorrow reality that the leaders of ISKCONhave created in what respect to the proper treatment of women and children.They hide then self behind what you properly call "Their Translation" of SrilaPrabhupada's transcendental instructions. I would also want to thank you forsharing your personal encounters you had the opportunity to have with SrilaPrabhupada by the Divine Grace of Sri Sri Nitai Gaura. You mention in your open letter "My faith in the Child Protection Agency isonly to the extent that Dira Govinda and Yasoda remain to run it. Theircommitment to our well being seems solid if not greater then their loyaltiesto the movements political concerns.." This is the most important point to beaddress not only on the Gurukula issue but in all the rest of the problems weare facing within the ISKCON institution. Any individual that compromisetheir commitment to server the vaishnavas and humanity at large with theirpolitical agendas should be divested of their position and , in this way not beallowed to affect the life of others. Regretfully, since Srila Prabhupada's departure this has been the way theinstitution has been manage, the so call spiritual leaders had allow totransgressed the devotees well been by prioritizing the solidification oftheir position of power. We should never loose the understanding that ISKCONis a tool that Srila Prabhupada manifested to serve his dear Gurudeva and toallow us to serve him; ISKCON in it self is not the goal. If the tool isproperly handle by a person or persons that with pure detachment are onlyconcern with the well been of the fallen souls. then it could be of service.If in the other hand, a group of hooligans miss used it and throughout it theytransgress the basic principles of humanity and perform the greatest missservice to Srila Prabhupada, we should reject it. We have two choices, either we work within ISKCON to remove the white spots ofleper or we commit our life to just surrender to Sri Krsna as per hisinstruction abandoning all type of religion and sincerely following theinstructions of Srila Prabhupada and our preceptors. At first the first choiceshould be consider the most important one because Prabhupada want us toaccomplish this, but we should not loose sight that any over endeavor thatcontaminate our spiritual progress should be rejected. If ISKCON institutionbecome a new institutionalize religion we have no choice other than reject it.We are not Srila Prabhupada and Prabhupada is not ISKCON. We should neverforget that ISKCON is a by product of Srila Prabhupada's vani and what we areobligate to serve is his vani. By serving Srila Prabhupada's vani we serve hismission even if the name ISKCON is not there, for this we have SrilaPrabhupada's own example. The spirit of Prabhupada's ISKCON will be always with those devotees like youthat have the proper disposition to serve others like he show us. Not withthose that legally hold some material papers that confer to then the power ofholding money and marvel, that ISKCON I personally do not feel motivated toserve. Prabhu, once again I want to thank you for sharing your inspiration andallowing us to associate with Srila Prabhupada trough your own association andremembrance. Yours in the service of Sri Sri Gur and Gauranga Madhava Asraya Dasa Dear Madhava Sraya, well said. Thank you. Some devotees may try to argue the point that ISKCON isnot Prabhupada and vice versa. I plan to share your letter with others todiscuss with you. Thank you for your support. PS did you read the 1st part of the two part series? Madhuha dasSubj: magic Date: 1/14/99 2:35:04 PM Pacific Standard Time From: danavir@icanect.net (Marvin Sarria) Pamho, ogtsp Hare Krsna Prabhu are you Ragunatha from LA? well, I know that you do not remember me since we did not have a friendship.Anyway, regarding yourcomments about Srila Prabhupada, I did not know him but by reading his books Ican feel his energy, love, affection, and above all his complete care towardshumanity and specially towards all Sri Krsna's Devotees. Thank you for writing about Srila Prabhupada, and I am sorry for all thesuffering Guru-Kulis like you endure at the hands of ignorant devotees. Your servant Madhu-ha das HDG Subj: Re: magic Date: 1/14/99 To: danavir@icanect.net Dear Madhuha Thank you. We know each other through Prabhuapda as step children know eachother through their parents, but we call it god-brothers. Howdy. There's Prabhupada in his books and then there is Prabhupada reflected in ourhearts as he has touched them as the essay's portrayed.Both are powerful andreveal Prabhupada. Unless of course this is Madhuha with the festival of Indiain which case, I 'm your fan and admirer as well. Haribol Prabhu. I m glad youliked the essay. Raghu Vipramukhya SwamiSubj: Re: (no subject) Date: 1/14/99 1:30:35 PM Pacific Standard Time From: Vipramukhya.Swami@com.bbt.se (COM: Vipramukhya Swami (TP BhaktivedantaManor - Maharaj, I've just looked over Chakra again and its just so exciting so see this inprint. It really is like seeing your work in print. It''s just reallyrewarding for a writer. Thank you I've recieved about 40 responses so far.Should I share the best of this correspondence with your readers. It isvery revealing and moving. Raghu Remember, we still have to print part II! Yes. Please share the letters with us and we may print some of them, butsend all of it to news@chakra.org. I will be traveling soon and won't beavailable. CHAKRA is an instrument to help ISKCON and devotees, whereas it seems VNNand others want to hurt ISKCON. It isn't harmful for ISKCON to facedifficult facts and own up to history as long as our objective is to build abetter movement for Srila Prabhupada's pleasure. Thank you for being who you are! Your servant, Vipramukhya Swami |